Author Topic: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation  (Read 12017 times)

Offline Haze

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #60 on: April 22, 2019, 02:58:06 PM »
It also confirms that Dave wasn't asked about this too.

So yeah, that basically 100% confirms that Barry did this without any permission from anybody, not even the minimal of effort to try and look legit.

I hope Dave is aware that at this point all he can relicense is the exact code he wrote himself in the original FB too.

Since FBA is a fork, he can't directly relicense FBA, even if he were to relicense FB, you'd have to create a new fork from his version and rewrite (or gain permission for) everything that's been added on top of that including core changes, ui changes, drivers etc. (and not just copy from the existing FBA code, because that would still be under an incompatible license)  You'd also have to make sure any additional libraries you depend on are under compatible licenses etc.

Also as hap points out, the original FB contains code not written by Dave in the first place too so his relicensing options even then are limited without removing all of that and anything that could be considered a derivative work of it.

Licensing is a bitch, but if you want a legitimate product you have to do it properly yet in this case it seems nobody at all bothered to follow due process here, not Barry, not Koch Media, nobody.  Even Capcom must take some blame too if they're going to allow this to hit market with their name on it.

The way this has been done also IMHO makes Barry's position in the project untenable.  Nobody outside of a select few is going to trust his word on licensing again, even if you do try to say you've been through the whole process.  You might want to consider a shuffle around of who maintains what (webpages, releases etc.) or the public image of the project is going to suffer.
« Last Edit: April 22, 2019, 04:26:46 PM by Haze »
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Offline Robert

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #61 on: April 23, 2019, 04:50:53 AM »
Interesting that my post along similar lines was deleted without explanation.

EDIT: And now it's back? Weird.
« Last Edit: May 01, 2019, 08:09:24 AM by Robert »

grant2258

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #62 on: April 23, 2019, 12:53:53 PM »
this isint the first time fba alpha and mame code where in breached atari flashback legends console done it no one said boo.

Offline hap

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #63 on: April 23, 2019, 01:54:20 PM »
I don't remember anything with Atari Flashback, but there's been plenty of boohissing every time an emulator project license is violated by a company. This time it's a bit more difficult since the FBA project lead is doing the part. And the rest of the FBA team aren't exactly enjoying it.

Offline lantus

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #64 on: April 23, 2019, 03:16:55 PM »
this isint the first time fba alpha and mame code where in breached atari flashback legends console done it no one said boo.

The difference is that ATGames just used it without asking anyone if they could. Same with HyperKin and that dumpster fire NeoGeo X.

Capcom proudly announced it on their press release/website.



Offline dink

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #65 on: April 23, 2019, 08:07:39 PM »
The difference is that ATGames just used it without asking anyone if they could. Same with HyperKin and that dumpster fire NeoGeo X.

dumpster fire, that's hilerious :)   In the case of NeoGeo X.. I wonder how they ended up breaking our emulation so badly?  :p

Offline Gab75

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #66 on: April 24, 2019, 01:22:08 AM »
Capcom proudly announced it on their press release/website.

As far as I know, it's not a real Capcom product, but a licensed product made by Koch Media... in any case, they're treating the copyright issues (at least with regard to the FB Alpha) with "great shallowness" !

PS: as grant2258 wrote, this isn't the first time that a company uses a software in an irregular manner, however this time it was done "very obviously" !  :confused:

Offline Haze

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #67 on: April 24, 2019, 04:12:02 AM »
As far as I know, it's not a real Capcom product, but a licensed product made by Koch Media... in any case, they're treating the copyright issues (at least with regard to the FB Alpha) with "great shallowness" !

PS: as grant2258 wrote, this isn't the first time that a company uses a software in an irregular manner, however this time it was done "very obviously" !  :confused:

Well Koch Media probably feel they can because Barry announced that they had licensed it.

The problem here is that Barry had absolutely no authority to do that, so the product isn't legal.

I guess Koch Media, and Capcom by association are willing to take the reputation hit and hoping people just take Barry to court over it instead, which is about the kind of shitty behaviour you'd expect.

Make no mistake tho, a member of your team created this mess, and must accept as much responsibility as anybody else.  FBA has sent out a clear message to all potential devs that the team simply don't care about the license under which they're been given code (or have taken code and used) and will happily just ignore it if somebody comes calling.  To anybody who does care about these things (the majority of the development community) your project is basically now dead.

« Last Edit: April 24, 2019, 04:19:41 AM by Haze »
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Offline hap

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #68 on: April 24, 2019, 06:00:30 AM »
Right, now with dayvee basically indicating he didn't hear of this, the chance that this license change was done legitimally is becoming infinitely small. For those that weren't around back then: The CPS1/2 driver was written way back in 2001 for the original Final Burn, a large portion of the source is still intact in FBA.

The only soothing factor remaining is whether Barry did this behind everyone's back on purpose or not. I think there's a good chance with him being the project admin thinking that he's the complete owner of all of FBA and had the right to do anything with it, and had no malicious intent. And now either he took a badly timed vacation, or is hiding from the unwanted pressure, escaping the bad situation he's in.

Offline barbudreadmon

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #69 on: April 24, 2019, 06:36:29 AM »
Make no mistake tho, a member of your team created this mess, and must accept as much responsibility as anybody else.  FBA has sent out a clear message to all potential devs that the team simply don't care about the license under which they're been given code (or have taken code and used) and will happily just ignore it if somebody comes calling.

Barry is the only one responsible of this mess, afaik no other dev agreed, so blaming the issue on the project & team as a whole seems wrong. Also, considering that he might have severed the link between fbalpha.com and neo-source.com the day of the announcement (am i the only one who noticed the disappearance of the forum link since then ?), imho he decided to follow his own path and doesn't care about the other devs.

Offline Haze

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #70 on: April 24, 2019, 08:02:53 AM »
Barry is the only one responsible of this mess, afaik no other dev agreed, so blaming the issue on the project & team as a whole seems wrong. Also, considering that he might have severed the link between fbalpha.com and neo-source.com the day of the announcement (am i the only one who noticed the disappearance of the forum link since then ?), imho he decided to follow his own path and doesn't care about the other devs.

Then you probably need to take the project forward with a new name, new domain, new social media account and and new person in charge of releases? or take control of the domain etc. (but I guess since FBA isn't trademarked AFAIK, there's no grounds for doing that)

After that, make an official statement regarding this, and why the FBA name etc. has been abandoned, and how you plan on proceeding.  Clarify the license, rebuild confidence, maybe look to move forward with a view to re-licensing the proper way (as MAME did) or stick firmly with what you have if you feel FBA is a good home for people who want to code things that can't be used in a commercial setting. 

It sounds like the interest in relicensing properly is there, but it would be a complex process and you're bound to have some developers that either say no, or you can't contact (or can't fully trace the origins code back to, eg. a lot of submissions from China and the like) so rewriting some bits from scratch is inevitable.  For MAME derived code it might be easier to just scrap what you have and report from current once you've relicensed.

The problem is of course, people know the FBA name, and some, oblivious to all of this, will continue to search out FBA rather than whatever you decide on.

Hiding / removing the forum link, which is basically the link to the actual development community behind the project, is very suspicious behaviour tho, yes.


« Last Edit: April 24, 2019, 08:13:21 AM by Haze »
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Offline Tatsuya79

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #71 on: April 24, 2019, 08:30:15 AM »
Or just cut out the individual that acted on his own, don't depend on him anymore as he made it clear he didn't care about the community and having the minimum of honest discussion.
That's what I would do, move the github, website where he wouldn't have admin right and not care about stuff like name or anything else, continue just the same without him.

...but I'm not a dev here and probably shouldn't say that, sorry if that's unwelcome.

Offline Haze

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #72 on: April 24, 2019, 08:38:38 AM »
Or just cut out the individual that acted on his own, don't depend on him anymore as he made it clear he didn't care about the community and having the minimum of honest discussion.
That's what I would do, move the github, website where he wouldn't have admin right and not care about stuff like name or anything else, continue just the same without him.

...but I'm not a dev here and probably shouldn't say that, sorry if that's unwelcome.

Problem is he controls the 'official' site and twitter account right now afaik.

Claims have been made in the name of FBA.  Trying to continue with the same name would be messy as you could potentially end up with 2 pieces of software being released with the same name, different content, different license claims etc.

f*** this place.  Please delete my account here.

kev

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #73 on: April 24, 2019, 10:15:50 AM »
Problem is he controls the 'official' site and twitter account right now afaik.

I know I am being naive based on the lack of response from kochmedia and other parties, but I am still trying to make those claims bogus. Until the weird looking thing is released with FBA on it, nothing has happened at this point beyond a very bad PR f***-up by Barry.
« Last Edit: April 24, 2019, 10:26:47 AM by kev »

Offline 7zxkv

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Re: Capcom Home Arcade stick using FB Alpha Emulation
« Reply #74 on: April 24, 2019, 10:45:33 AM »
So we will have to expect a FBG(amma) if barry does not speak ?